he has blocked before at the request of erdogan multiple times.
Free speech absolutism at work
Fascist speech absolutism at work
To Der Elon that’s the same thing.
It’s frustrating that we knew he was full of shit when he was saying it. And now the evidence is showing it is bullshit. And it’s like it doesn’t even matter.
They know they can do that sort of shit because they hold the power. They can blatantly and unconvincingly lie, their followers will regurgitate those lies, but neither of them really believe them. They are just posturing and having fun with words, just like fascists always have done.
Never believe that [fascists] are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies. They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. The [fascists] have the right to play. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors. They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past.
That’s a neat quote, what’s it from?
We knew it was bullshit about 3 days after he took over when he banned literally the 1 person he specifically said he was not going to ban.
X restricted Imamoglu’s account in Turkey complying with a legal request by Turkish authorities who cited national security and public order concerns.
https://x.com/GlobalAffairs/status/1920426409358455081
“full of shit” = “standing up for free speech against governments that are trying to censor political opponents” ?
How is what you quoted “standing up” to anything? Am I missing something?
Am I missing something?
Yes. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you might have taken the quoted text and the link as being the same thing, when they are 2 separate things.
The X link is a post from X Global Government Affairs regarding this Turkey censorship situation. Some of the text from it:
X received an order to restrict access in Türkiye to the account of the now-detained Mayor of Istanbul. While we have followed Türkiye’s order regarding the account, we strongly disagree with the order and are challenging the order in court. In the spirit of full transparency, we are sharing the court order and our legal filing below.
The order was received from the Turkish Information and Communication Technologies Authority. These orders require X to block content in Türkiye that is available in the rest of the world.
Lack of compliance with these orders can lead to severe sanctions, including throttling of the entire platform in Türkiye. X complied with the court order while we challenge the order in court because we believe keeping the platform accessible in Türkiye is vital to supporting freedom of expression and access to information, particularly following natural disasters and other emergencies.
In the spirit of upholding due process, we carefully review all the requests under the local law. X has been and will continue to object to removal orders including government requests in courts to protect users when those requests do not align with principles of free expression, due process, or other local laws.
Basically the government threatened X to censor that account in Turkey or face severe punishment, like many censorship-happy governments have done lately. X complied but are taking them to court over their order, like they have done with all the other censorship-happy governments who have done the same thing.
BlueSky banned the politicians account there btw. They aren’t challenging the order in court.
- How is censoring a politician “standing up for free speech”?
- “full of shit” = not a “free speech absolutist”. “free speech absolutist” implies that you will not censor any speech no matter what.
You don’t seem to understand how the legal system and governments work.
They issued a legal request to censor his account in Turkey. Failure to do so would result in severe consequences for X, such as having to take X offline for all of Turkey.
X complied with the law and are challenging the censorship request in court, the only place that has the power to overrule the government.
You don’t seem to understand how the legal system and governments work.
I am not a lawyer but I do understand how jurisdictions work. Elon is not in theirs.
Failure to do so would result in severe consequences for X, such as having to take X offline for all of Turkey.
If he were a “free speech absolutist” as he claims, he would let them.
You didn’t answer my question.
Elon isn’t. X is.
I did answer your question. Last paragraph.
X is.
No it is not. Twitter is a US company with US servers. If you want to argue that the US is now a territory of Turkey, please cite a source.
I did answer your question.
No you didn’t.
X restricted Imamoglu’s account in Turkey complying with a legal request by Turkish authorities who cited national security and public order concerns.
Do you know how legal requests work?
Nazi platform.
Make sure to stop clicking on Nazi links when people post them. No matter how bad you want to see someone “prank” someone or cry about their perceived persecution.
We need to stop making a Nazi platform important enough that it hurts democratic politicians when they lose access because of the Nazi in charge of said platform.
and if you absolutely must see something on twitter, use xcancel instead.
its a frontend for the same content, that doesn’t add views or ad revenue to twitter.
ABC is a nazi platform now?
Ekrem is Kemalist, which is very similar to a literal Nazi, but in the current world I’ll even agree he’s kinda better than many other variants.
You might find this interesting, because Erdogan is also a Kemalist (at least some variation of it).
Ah yes, I can see how you can see the guy who used religion all his political career to his advantage and shat on the constitution just so he can stay in power longer, as a Kemalist.
/s
Like legit, the guy hates Ataturk’s guts, yet these idiots claim that he is a Kemalist.
I want what they are smoking. Must be some pretty good shit.
As I said, it’s a baseline for Turkey. Relative to that baseline he’s almost an Islamist, yep. Relative to it he was also a liberal initially.
The dude is trying to delete Mustafa Kemal’s name everywhere, claiming he is a kemalist is the equivelant of calling Stalin a nazi,
It is from a point of view of political science. He hates Ataturk but that doesn’t prevent him to use his methods.
he isnt comparable the toenail of Mustafa Kemal. All he does is selling off state properties and factories, polar opposite of what Ataturk did.
That’s an emotional reply. However he did fucked up the country pretty bad. But he uses Ataturk’s methods to stay in power, which apparently he studied them well. Of course it doesn’t describe him alone, he’s a combination of an Islamist, a centrist and a Kemalist. More or like what an islamokemalist is.
I know, it’s basically impossible to be a politician in Turkey and not some kind of that.
If you look at most Sunni societies, their political ideology optimal point is simple - behead all the infidels, take all that belongs to Muslims, and that’d be all that Muslims claim, and institute Sharia law.
Young Turks and Kemal managed to transform that into a viable nationalist ideology. To be centered on Turks instead of Sunnis.
No secular regime in a Middle-Eastern Muslim country after them has managed to achieve that.
So - Erdogan’s Muslim part in ideology is about equating Muslim and Ottoman, not about returning to the initially described system.
Of course, it does not have the same goal. But it uses the same system.
Ah yes, the guy who had no ill will towards anybody, tried to unify people to the best of his ability, and provided cheaper food for the poor… is a Nazi!
Holy shit, the sheer stupidity needed to come up with such a take!
Ah yes, the guy who had no ill will towards anybody, tried to unify people to the best of his ability, and provided cheaper food for the poor… is a Nazi!
You mean Mustafa Kemal had no ill will when his army was massacring 200k Armenians in Kars and further during Turkish-Armenian war of 1920? Or burning Smyrna with its inhabitants?
The best argument in favor of any pessimism about future is how Westerners conditioned to know that Hitler is bad, very bad, praise Mustafa Kemal Atatürk. BTW, in kinda similar terms to the popular praise of Hitler in English-speaking countries before the war.
As a person he was absolutely not better, however he was intelligent enough to pick achievable goals.
I hear often Nazi this Nazi that? I think it has lost meaning. Can you explain what Nazi is? Vs Nazi from like WW2?
If you perform a Nazi salute, you’re a Nazi.
Musk performed TWO Nazi salutes on national television during a presidential inauguration.
Musk owns X.
Anymore questions? Do I need to illustrate with crayons?
Tim Waltz, one of the people vigorously calling Musk a Nazi for doing that action, is on video doing the exact same “salute”:
You’ll agree Tim Waltz is a Nazi, I assume?
Some would say a Roman salute 🫡 So anything else substantial? That can’t be interpreted as something else?
But anything else? that’s what I’m asking
There’s plenty:
But this is the most I am willing to engage at the moment with an obvious troll
not my job and this is not the place to waste my time providing a textbook-level of evidence of what you could have researched yourself if you were willing to be persuaded, but ask your History teacher if you’re seriously asking.
If you can’t answer him that’s all you have to say.
Don’t do this rigamarole of “do your own research to justify why other people use their words.”
Then why did you reply to me?
I know what a Nazi is However people often misuse it with people they disagree with. Elon already had a lot of hate before that.
Can a Jew be a Nazi? Are Kanye a Nazi?
People with their beehive mentality, just echoes being what other people says. Can’t have simple discussions without people trying crucify you for asking questions.
Italian here, Roman actually.
The Roman salute has not origin in ancient history.
It was formalized by Gabriele D’Annunzio, a sick fascist poet and writer, as a salute for his proto-fascist troops with which he occupied Fiume in modern-day Croatia, having been inspired this painting.
So yea, the roman salute is a fascist salute, invented by a fascist, for a fascist occurrence and to call it roman is a disservice to Rome and history in general.
Some people wouldn’t know a Nazi if he was sending people to camps without trial, trying to outlaw the political opposition, fomenting a cult of personality, launching coups, oppressing the most vulnerable people, ratcheting up racist attacks, and threatening to attack Denmark.
Would Xi jinping be a Nazi?
I believe he likes to be called Winnie
He’s certainly a fascist autocrat
As a serious answer, Musk is into modern variants of eugenics and some scary techno-authoritarian stuff he shares with Peter Theil and other Silicon Valley royalty.
Maybe he’s a techno-neonazi? That’s just semantics.
His alleged Nazi salute is indeed kind of a red herring. But “Nazi” is an reasonable enough descriptor for his beliefs.
Note how Jin, the Nazi Defender (not a Nazi themselves, they just defend people who are justifiably called Nazis) won’t respond to your answer.
One feature from Reddit I liked was the ability to tag people. Or maybe that was the reddit enhancement suite. But Jin would’ve earned himself a big red “Nazi Defender” tag.
Nah its much simpler label than that.
“Troll”
The topic doesn’t matter, it more about fishing for provocation. In this case I couldn’t help myself, but… you know, don’t feed the trolls.
you can also tag people on Lemmy, or at least I can. look for the About User menu then “Add Tag” or “Tag user” from their profile
Hmm… I definitely don’t see an About user menu or Add Tag or Tag User on their profile. Maybe it has something to do with your lemmy browser.
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That must be specific to whatever app you are using. It isn’t in the default ones.
I can appreciate this is reply, thanks 👍
His alleged Nazi salute is indeed kind of a red herring.
Tim Waltz did the exact same salute btw. The same Tim Waltz that says that Trump 100% did a nazi salute. I guess Tim Waltz is a Nazi too.
Here’s the full, non cropped video. It’s around the 1:51 mark.
It’s not around the 1:15 mark, it’s around the 2min mark. Same “salute” as Musk.
It really isn’t. It’s not even close. You said I had gold medal mental gymnastics, but you’ve just done another gold medal performance.
E: but thank you for pointing out my typo
His gesture is as much of a “Nazi salute” as Elon Musks. They’re either both Nazi salutes, or neither are. No other option.
One of these things is not like the other
Tim Waltz does not have eugenics-adjacent beliefs.
Also, I think you may have misinterpreted what “red herring” means.
I didn’t misinterpret that, I was simply pointing out that it wasn’t a nazi salute unless you also think Tim Waltz is a nazi.
Yes notice the crisp snappy way waltz did it? With fingers together, and twice so there is no way to doubt what it was? Ohhh wait sorry that was elons.
Yeah, elon’s not a nazi…
…he just wanted to send out a message of hope and support to nazis round the world by siegheiling twice on stage behind the seal of the United States…yeah…
hahahaha the mental gymnastics is gold medal worthy.
And you are bringing up a red herring (salutes) that doesn’t matter, because, well, I don’t know. But that’s the whole point of the saying.
It is funny how the video clearly disproves your lying claim.
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simple asked what the difference was and if there was anything substantial. Jews and other still use x or Tesla , people are being aggressive if you talk about it.
Great movie
I think it has lost meaning.
It has. Completely. Basically what it means today is “people who disagree with me” and should be regarded as such. Unfortunately the actual nazis will fly under the radar now.
The word ‘nazi’ has 100% lost its meaning.
Might as well just be saying “I don’t like this person or group of people because they disagree with me.”
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I guess we can start adding ‘nazi sympathizer’ to the list of terms that have lost their meaning.
Remember, you only have people like yourself to blame.
Dude, Musk literally thinks he has superior genes. The fuck are you high on?
X restricted Imamoglu’s account in Turkey complying with a legal request by Turkish authorities who cited national security and public order concerns.
X are also challenging the legal order in court: https://x.com/GlobalAffairs/status/1920426409358455081
You’ve called the good guys here the nazis and let the actual authoritarians off the hook scott-free.
You’ve called the good guys here the nazis and let the actual authoritarians off the hook scott-free.
Only if you ignore that Twitter is owned by a nazi, and that the person above didn’t say anything about letting, the authoritarian regime in turkey off the hook.
Only if you ignore that Twitter is owned by a nazi
It’s not.
It’s not
It is.
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No? I don’t like lots of people, and only the far right fascist supporters, and nazis, and nazi simps I call nazis. I didn’t call elon, Hitler. So go stroke your ego elsewhere
You: “I don’t just call anyone I don’t like nazi or hitler!”
Also you: proceeds to call everyone I don’t like nazi or hitler
I can give you 10 people I don’t like and only one of them I know definitely to be a nazi.
That one guy is Elon Musk.
Perhaps you have not been following the news. Elon Musk owns Twitter these days.
I know they would comply just as well, as I stated in another comment, because they are a private platform, but actually in this case the presence on Bluesky of the Imamoglu account in perfect condition with 129K followers proves that something else must be the case here.
Also, X didn’t give a shit about complying in Brazil.
Nah, Nazi platform does nazi stuff, it’s that simple.
You can come down the mirror now.
Bluesky blocked his account in turkey btw, just like X did. Bluesky have made no mention of challenging the legal request in court like X have though.
Iirc the Brazil situation was the first time anything like this had happened since Musk bought Twitter. They definitely didn’t handle it correctly, but they’ve clearly learned since then. Now they comply with legal requests and challenge them through the courts. Would you prefer they just folded every time and didn’t challenge, like all the others? Like Bluesky?
Good work on calling me a nazi though! I did nazi that coming!!
The fact that Bluesky didn’t post about it doesn’t mean they did not challenge.
Also, a file on Google Drive is not a petition submitted. There is nowhere a letter signed or stamped as received.
You know you can pay a law firm for drafting a letter and then not send it, right?
There are too many conclusions you are coming to without knowing the actual facts.
I judge what happened for sure.
And for sure both of them complied, officially asked to or not, to obscuring a political prisoner’s account (and dozens of other activists as well, by the way).
Also, regarding X, this is old news, from the end of March.
Also, are you X? Like, the platform, its personification? Because if you are not, then I didn’t call you a nazi. You can go clean your snot from your neckbeard.
So your position is that X aren’t challenging the censorship request in court?
That’s one hill to die on I guess.
The X post is from the other day, not March.
My position is that there is no way to assert it really did.
The ban of his account were present in Italian news since March: https://www.lapresse.it/esteri/2025/03/22/turchia-x-di-elon-musk-sospende-account-dellopposizione/
This is old news.
X responding to it with this statement is not old news. It literally happened the other day.
No one on X should expect anything better
If they’re still on Xitter it means they approve of this
People on X expected what is actually happening, not what people in here think is happening (and hope it is).
- The Turkish government ordered a legal request to ban the opposition leaders account in Turkey.
- X complied with the legal request, as there are huge penalties for not complying
- X immediately started the process to challenge the legal request in court
This is what most people on X expect, which is to fight for free speech on X.
Anyone still on Xitter is part of the problem.
Delete it.
Seems like a good opportunity to frame Musk and Erdogan as allies.
You’re saying it’s not related to musk’s political views?
No. How did you reach that conclusion?
Because framing is usually done in bad faith, when i read that i read ‘they arent allies, the media wants you to think that’
Not necessarily. I just meant in the context they provide for the event.
X restricted Imamoglu’s account in Turkey complying with a legal request by Turkish authorities who cited national security and public order concerns.
No, it’s not. It’s related to the legal takedown request that they were given.
But Elon has no clue why everyone thinks he’s a nazi
The speech free platform continues to remove speech.
You can speak freely about whatever suits elon :-)
You said it, it’s not a free speech platform, it’s a speech free platform.
X restricted Imamoglu’s account in Turkey complying with a legal request by Turkish authorities who cited national security and public order concerns.
X also are challenging the legal order in court: https://x.com/GlobalAffairs/status/1920426409358455081
Has Musk ever met a dictator he doesn’t like?
I think elon called Lula a dictator…and called the UK a dictatorship. That makes it even more obvious what he’s doing.
He also said Canada is ‘not a real country’ so…
Yes, but that’s not a dictator fetish (ok, it is, but it is a different one)… He knows dictators are a bad thing to be, because he calls the people he doesn’t like one. But he never calls out actual dictators, he actually makes deals with them and helps them. That says he likes and respects that model of governance, even if he knows it is deeply unpopular and deeply disrespects functioning democracies. And uses it to rouse his stans.
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X restricted Imamoglu’s account in Turkey complying with a legal request by Turkish authorities who cited national security and public order concerns.
https://x.com/GlobalAffairs/status/1920426409358455081
X complied with a legal order, and are challenging it in court just like they do every other time a government orders something like this to be done.
Put the pitchfork away.
Just do like I do. I blocked x.com quite a while back now. Along with several other trash sites like it.
I used to use it to find out information on local emergencies and stuff but now you have to log in and they don’t allow search or whatever so I never use it… I have a few accounts there but haven’t used them since at least x if not before I should probably mass delete my accounts there next time something happens
Just a friendly gesture among right-wing autocrats.
Xitler.
Expecting Bluesky to do the same in a short while.
Why?
There needs to be some sort of unblockable self-hosted broadcast system where users can spin up their own cloud hosted instance by entering a username and password and choosing one of hundreds of providers for a small fee, or self hosted instance as quickly and easily as installing a single app on an android phone. These with act just like websites, but with a common protocol and API so they can communicate with each other and with clients with no specific add-on. Then, Turkey or whoever could block Turkish ISPs from fulfilling that request, but anyone else could still access the instance in their client as long as their own instance doesn’t block it.
Hostable on a phone, a windows PC, Linux PC, self-hosted VM, cloud rented VM, whatever. And easily portable from one place to another.
Sure, uptime and reliability would suffer, EG when PC is turned off, but that’s acceptable to gain resilience against ISP, central services like google and Facebook and twitter, and government interference.
I have designed a system to do this, using very reliable existing protocols and programming frameworks, I just don’t have the time or money to invest to make it happen.
Is it called the fediverse?
You’ve pretty much just described ActivityPub and the Fediverse.
Anyone can spin up their own instance. You can self host on a machine in your house, or with any cloud provider. You can broadcast messages in Twitter-style or Reddit-style format. Anyone can navigate to your web address and see your messages. Anyone who federates with you can see it on their website. FOSS Android apps are available.
You can’t force anyone to actually read your messages of course, but that’s a different matter.
Hah, I designed one as well!
I think the flow of information has to be fundamentally different.
In mine, people only receive data directly from people they know and trust in real life. This makes scaling easy, and makes it impossible for centralized entities to broadcast propaganda to everyone at once.
I described it at freetheinter.net if you’re interested
Maybe I’m misunderstanding, isn’t that basically what signal does?
Essentially, yes. Great point! I think it needs more features to function more like a social network (transitive topic-based sharing, for one)
I have discovered the Gemini protocol yesterday.
Hosting what they call a capsule would be easy and extremely lightweight and I could surf from an index using an app called Lagrange, available on F-Droid.
Can you explain how your system differs?
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What content broke the laws? Can you give more info? BlueSky has been pretty good so far so this surprises me
I left a precedent in another top-level comment (a screenshot). Also, broke the laws is not my standard in these cases.
I thought they didn’t block political figures… Guess the muskrat just meant the figures he agrees with…
They comply with local laws and legal orders, like the one that forced them to do this:
X restricted Imamoglu’s account in Turkey complying with a legal request by Turkish authorities who cited national security and public order concerns.
X also are challenging the legal order in court: https://x.com/GlobalAffairs/status/1920426409358455081
Reason # 3,487 to get off/stop paying attention to X, the ‘everything app’.
